Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
November 8th Live Update
#11
I fell asleep watching the presentation, but I drew several conclusions from what I did see.

Jerry wants to use government force (mandates) to kill gasoline and diesel power, which means the total decimation of the world energy economy. That is totally opposed to the freedom which I love and support. Even if the product becomes feasible, which it is not currently, I will never buy or support anything ElectraMeccanica sells.

Also, his hypocrisy is astounding. Look at the core businesses of his Chinese "partner", and you will find that they are heavily invested in producing fossil-fuel powered products and vehicles.

I really am done with this nonsense.
I'm done.
Reply
#12
Can't kill all gas and diesel power.........Jerry needs gas and diesel to deliver SOLOs worldwide. Smile

The strict anti-I.C.E. philosopy turns too many people off and is not a wise business marketing strategy. We need both. I.C.E. fans are potential EMV customers, using the SOLO Commuter EV as a supplement to their family I.C.E..
White Hot Solo #166
Reply
#13
There were some announcements worth noting.

EMV will be at SEMA again this year. Hopefully they'll have a higher profile and more video coverage than last year. Oct 31 - Nov 3.

Concerning how nice the convertible roadster EV is , Jerry stated,
"And that's a good reason why we've taken reservations on thousands of Tofinos."
And, concerning EMV's overall sales, "So we posted that $1.6 billion in sales have been received."

Electric Brakes and Electric Steering coming... Jerry said, "We'll keep you posted on that."

AC is still an option, is being tested now and according to Jerry... "Will be on the early models."

Heated seats are still standard.

And finally, the battery pack and system is said to have a temperature control system and a range of up to 120mi.
The battery pack was said to be made up of 18650s. I'm actually looking at a bunch of 18650s on my desk as I type.
It's stated that those new packs/systems will be put into the vehicles as soon as the their patent is successfully registered.
Required listening... House of Lords - Can't find my way home
This version kicks. There's just no other way to describe it. Shivers. Turn...it...up!
Disclaimer: No false statistics were supported, displayed or harmed in the making of this post.
Reply
#14
(10-13-2017, 12:16 PM)DiscjockeyDale Wrote: In my honest opinion, I don't think the present small facility is has anywhere near the capability to produce 400 a quarter regardless of staffing.
Look. They're not building cars from scratch but sub-assemblies built elsewhere. Three or four people could probably put together 10 Solos per quarter in a two-car garage. They have plenty of storage space for loads of parts and could produce ~10/day if they were serious with three shifts/day and ~21h/d production time. They could run another shift on weekends for more per week.

I don't know why they are piddling around about production. My best guesses at the moment are that instead of producing Solos they have been training assemblers or just waiting around for safety certification.

It's most likely that they expect USAian certification and production will be sooner and larger than Canadian, so they may ramp up in USA first. That's much more likely than shipping from China. Just look at the pins on our map. Where would you build a big factory with Trump in charge of things for the next few years?
My blog is an eclectic list of rants and commentary about things for which I care. See MrPogson.com It's been around a decade...
Reply
#15
(10-13-2017, 03:10 PM)pogson Wrote: Look. They're not building cars from scratch but sub-assemblies built elsewhere. Three or four people could probably put together 10 Solos per quarter in a two-car garage. They have plenty of storage space for loads of parts and could produce ~10/day if they were serious with three shifts/day and ~21h/d production time. They could run another shift on weekends for more per week.

I don't know why they are piddling around about production. My best guesses at the moment are that instead of producing Solos they have been training assemblers or just waiting around for safety certification.

It's most likely that they expect USAian certification and production will be sooner and larger than Canadian, so they may ramp up in USA first. That's much more likely than shipping from China. Just look at the pins on our map. Where would you build a big factory with Trump in charge of things for the next few years?

That's why I said I'm leaving you to your own conclusions.
I included quite a few direct quotes from Jerry clearly stating that he WILL be shipping units from China.
We very much disagree on the capability of the present "factory". Jerry even stated that he believes they'll reach the maximum estimated rate of 10 a month soon.

You have the right to believe what you want in spite of overwhelming recorded evidence to the contrary.
Required listening... House of Lords - Can't find my way home
This version kicks. There's just no other way to describe it. Shivers. Turn...it...up!
Disclaimer: No false statistics were supported, displayed or harmed in the making of this post.
[+] 1 user Likes DiscjockeyDale's post
Reply
#16
I would prefer made in China and assembled in North America.  The most efficient and cost effective manufacturing process will prevail. The good news is Zongshen is noted for it's build quality whether they ship parts and subassemblies to be assembled in Canada, or fully assembled SOLOs.
White Hot Solo #166
Reply
#17
(10-13-2017, 05:43 PM)Rickb Wrote: I would prefer built in China and assembled in North America.

I have no objection to building Solo in China. I just don't think it's necessary for the "signature series" cars or even the likely demand in Canada. China has about 40 times our population and China is seriously trying to go solar and ban ICE. China can soak up all the proposed production and more. Meanwhile Canada is just beginning to make a plan, maybe, and so far there's no subsidy or inducement in Manitoba. It probably costs ~$500 to ship a Solo to Canada from China, about what the cost of Canadian labour would be to assemble one here. It's much cheaper to ship parts than a car. Shippers charge by a combination of weight and volume.

My RED Solo, #5xx, could easily be produced in BC long before Chinese production is expected if EMV made full use of their facility for production instead of prototyping, training, or whatever they do now. A second assembly line may be needed if they can't dedicate that line to production.
My blog is an eclectic list of rants and commentary about things for which I care. See MrPogson.com It's been around a decade...
Reply
#18
I meant to say made in China assembled in North America. Regardless of where it's assembled the parts are made in China (or worldwide as Jerry stated) and those parts and/or sub assemblies will ship from China (or from wherever). My understanding.
White Hot Solo #166
Reply
#19
(10-13-2017, 06:38 PM)pogson Wrote:
(10-13-2017, 05:43 PM)Rickb Wrote: I would prefer built in China and assembled in North America.

I have no objection to building Solo in China. I just don't think it's necessary for the "signature series" cars or even the likely demand in Canada. China has about 40 times our population and China is seriously trying to go solar and ban ICE. China can soak up all the proposed production and more. Meanwhile Canada is just beginning to make a plan, maybe, and so far there's no subsidy or inducement in Manitoba. It probably costs ~$500 to ship a Solo to Canada from China, about what the cost of Canadian labour would be to assemble one here. It's much cheaper to ship parts than a car. Shippers charge by a combination of weight and volume.

My RED Solo, #5xx, could easily be produced in BC long before Chinese production is expected if EMV made full use of their facility for production instead of prototyping, training, or whatever they do now. A second assembly line may be needed if they can't dedicate that line to production.

Look at it this way...
Many of us have been concerned about lack of a lack of transparency from start-ups that we befriend at one time or another.
If you listen to what Jerry said in the 10/12 update and cherry-pick, the information is there. A few Ah-hahs, but not a lack of transparency.

I understand that you had a tractor shipped from China some time ago.
Have you had anything major shipped from there lately?

For some odd reason, the Chinese now get a preferred rate on shipping to the US.
Try shipping something halfway across Canada or from Canada to halfway across the US.
Then have an identical package sent from China and inquire about the shipping cost.
It's called China Post and it's most often less than a third of the cheapest domestic US shipping.
And it includes the part of the trip from the port of entry to your doorstep.
It drives ebay sellers mad and the unfair competition causes many to quit.

So, let's say it does cost ~$500 from China to YOUR DRIVEWAY.
What do you think the total cost is going to be to have all the parts and "sub-assemblies"...
First shipped separately from China to Vancouver, Assembled in Vancouver...
And then have the complete (now with a larger footprint than the parts) unit re-shipped to your door?

You anticipate that it's only going to only cost ~$500 in labor to assemble it in Vancouver.
I certainly hope that estimate is in USD instead of in (which I suspect is the case) Canadian dollars.
Including legal, taxes, payroll, benefits, supporting staff and the entire cost of maintaining a larger facility?
Even Elio Motors was figuring on a ~$1000 USD domestic assembly cost per unit all told.

As far as the Chinese domestic market "soaking up the entire Chinese Solo production"...
In case you missed the posts about it, GM and the Chinese already offer a mini two-seater EV...

For the equivalent of around $5000 USD. It's a Nice looking little vehicle. And it's not the only one.
I believe the next logical step is for them to add another $2K in compliance & speed and ship them to the US.

"My RED Solo, #5xx, could easily be produced in BC long before Chinese production is expected if..."

That's 7 months away. At the moment EMV is still producing pre-production vehicles at their Canadian facility.
Jerry said exactly that several times in Thursday's update. And there seem to be a number of good reasons for it.
Just one major issue is that they're waiting on a patent before they can install batteries larger than 8.2kWh.
They're still waiting on AC. And on Canadian and US compliance for overall economic and logistical purposes.

Add to that the need for a few more "EMV fleet" vehicles that take precedence over #5xx...

The Chinese production is going to start shipping 5000 vehicles by April - May next year.
Here are the estimated delivery dates available @ https://electrameccanica.com/delivery-dates/

Electra Meccanica SOLO Delivery Dates
Car Number:
*Estimated Delivery Date:
10 – 50 Q2 – 2018
51 – 400 Q3 – 2018
401 – 800 Q4 – 2018
Delivery estimate for new reservations is Q4 2018.
Send us an email for your car number.

Could your Red #5xx and all the 5xx Solos with lower numbers be produced in Vancouver by April-May?

Maybe... With many built sans the final production configurations and bulk compliance.
And with assemblers constantly tripping over parts, vehicles and each other.
And all that with a superhuman EMV effort at a high cost per unit.
Jerry's already discussed the lack of Canadian subsidies.

It would be a madhouse in that little facility.

At this point, EMV has absolutely no reason to inflict that upon themselves.
Is that really the way you want your red #5xx built and quality checked?
Required listening... House of Lords - Can't find my way home
This version kicks. There's just no other way to describe it. Shivers. Turn...it...up!
Disclaimer: No false statistics were supported, displayed or harmed in the making of this post.
[+] 1 user Likes DiscjockeyDale's post
Reply
#20
(10-13-2017, 10:18 PM)DiscjockeyDale Wrote: It's called China Post and it's most often less than a third of the cheapest domestic US shipping.

China Post is about small parcels for small/light items. I paid full price for shipping my tractor a few years ago. It cost about the same to ship it to Vancouver as it did to ship it to my driveway from Vancouver.

China Post's subsidy is China's way of supporting small businesses. USA could do that too if they wanted. Instead they offer tax breaks to big corporations which small businesses cannot use because they lack teams of lawyers and accountants. Canada did the same to me when I tried to start a small business. I wanted to claim a tax-rebate for building a prototype. GM could do that, but I couldn't. You see, GM was making $millions and didn't need the rebate but I did... I know that doesn't make any sense but it's government policy.

Meanwhile, USA pays farmers not to grow stuff or subsidizes what they do grow while complaining about unfair competition from overseas. Same goes for oil/coal/manufacturers. It's perfectly legitimate for government to subsidize folks to steer the economy to greater productivity or efficiency. It's not OK to complain when others do it.

e.g. My wife happens to know lots of USAians. She sometimes compares prices of goods in Canada and USA. Guess why eggs are half the price in USA as in Canada? USA pays farmers to grow corn so it's cheaper for the chickens. (<-link) Meanwhile, Canada enables egg-producers to maintain higher prices by managing supply.(<-link)...
My blog is an eclectic list of rants and commentary about things for which I care. See MrPogson.com It's been around a decade...
[+] 1 user Likes pogson's post
Reply


Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)