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I got to sit in Solo #1
#21
Jamaf... Thanks for the great first hand review.
Well done and extremely appreciated.

I just checked my '03-'04 Mustang and it's got the same thing going on.
The height difference between the floor and the door seal  is at least 6".
And the seat is extremely low. It does take an effort to get in and out.

However, obviously they've sold too many Mustangs for it to be a deal breaker.

I admit, for anyone not used to having to lift their trailing leg in over the "hump"...
It's a new and often unnerving experience. But you adapt and get used to it quickly.
Once you're in the Mustang, the  seating is comfortable for hundreds of miles of travel.

I took some pictures with my phone.
I'll send them to myself and post them tomorrow.

I just hope EMV doesn't try to fix what I regard as a non-problem...
And in the process negatively effect the Solo's current weight distribution and/or center of gravity.

I just really think that one change here could cascade into a whole can of worms.
I think the best "fix" would be a handhold to aid in pulling oneself in and out like the 'Stang has.

What's the saying? If it ain't broke...
Required listening... House of Lords - Can't find my way home
This version kicks. There's just no other way to describe it. Shivers. Turn...it...up!
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#22
The ElectraMeccanica designers, engineers, and car builders have the inhouse ability to make it better.  It sounds like The ElectraM Team members (or Jerry) may have been the first to recognize the problem during everyday road testing miles and intend to fix it.  I trust the InterMeccanica car builders will build the production model right........without opening the can of worms.  

On the side view, with the door open, I can visualize a minor mod opportunity to cut that sill down a notch and/or raise the seat platform without impacting the integrity of the vehicle.  The Solo has to be functional for the 'worldwide' mass market........or it becomes a niche market commuter.
White Hot Solo #166
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#23
(11-27-2016, 02:33 AM)Rickb Wrote: The ElectraMeccanica designers, engineers, and car builders have the inhouse ability to make it better.  It sounds like The ElectraM Team members (or Jerry) may have been the first to recognize the problem during everyday road testing miles and intend to fix it.  I trust the InterMeccanica car builders will build the production model right........without opening the can of worms.  

On the side view, with the door open, I can visualize a minor mod opportunity to cut that sill down a notch and/or raise the seat platform without impacting the integrity of the vehicle.  The Solo has to be functional for the 'worldwide' mass market........or it becomes a niche market commuter.

Are they going to cut into the battery (or leave some cells out) and therefore decrease the range and/or make the Solo heavy on one side?
Or are they going to raise the center of gravity slightly which may very well necessitate "slight" changes in the steering/suspension and so on...?
On one hand, you're talking about redesigning the battery system and on the other, making changes to at least the steering and suspension.
If they were to "cut that sill down a notch", you'd probably be talking about modifying the battery, frame, the body panel and the door.
Raising the seat will restrict headroom for taller individuals and could lead to redesigning the cab... well, no wait a minute...
It just occurred to me that just raising the seat still won't solve the "problem"...

But simply lifting your leg over the existing hump will.

The following is especially true in a vehicle that's been well engineered in such an already tight interdependent package.

Almost every time you change a vehicle you have to compromise.
To get something, you have to give on something somewhere else.
Perhaps I should describe the term "can of worms" a little more clearly.
Changing the weight distribution and/or center of gravity in the slightest...
Could possibly cascade into necessary changes in steering and suspension.
Changes in steering/suspension could cascade into further "minor" changes.

I wish the possible "fixes" were that simplistic and had absolutely no chance of affecting anything else.
But that is the better part of what's happened to the $123M ICE three-wheeler we all love and hate.
Namely, engineering 'on the fly' to "fix" what often times may have been essentially non-problems.

So, do we want to be discussing "minor" changes to non-problems years from now...
For example, this being the start of a long line of reasons that the Solo was delayed for years?

I hope you're not suggesting that the popular and comfortable '99 - '04 Ford Mustang was not "functional for the worldwide mass market."
And is "only a niche market" vehicle. As I said, I really don't see the slightest problem with the Solo as it is.

I'll try to have those photos up tomorrow so demonstrate why I feel that way so stongly.
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#24
Dale, I'm no engineer...........I'll leave the fix to the ElectraM engineering team.  I seriously doubt they will compromise the Solo in any way.  ElectraM does not engineer on the fly.  Rather it may be considered a necessary modification of the production model prototype after miles of everyday road testing.   

Regarding raising the seat ........if it impacts headroom for a small % of taller people let them buy an Elio.  
Keep in mind it was ElectraM that identified the potential problem for old geezers commuting for coffee and donuts and woman wearing skirts on their daily commutes. It may be fine for young whipper snappers like you with no back, knee, or mobility issues, but perhaps it could be better for all.  It really doesn't matter what you or I think about it.......they will do what they need to do.  It looks awkward, ElectraM says it can be fixed, hell let them fix it.  If they can't do a simple fix they will no doubt leave it as is.   I don't know if it's an issue for me until I test drive it.  I won't encourage Jerry in any way so stay calm.    If it turns out to be an issue, I'll buy the SRK.......a win win for three wheelers.

Regarding the Mustang, I've driven one.  Sweet, but I didn't see it as functional enough to own one.  I needed a 4 door sedan and a pickup.  I couldn't afford a fun sporty ride like the Mustang.  However, I can get by with the Solo's single door on a commuter vehicle designed and marketed to be a functional supplement to my current 4 door.
White Hot Solo #166
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#25
(11-27-2016, 12:11 PM)Rickb Wrote: Dale, I'm no engineer...........I'll leave the fix to the ElectraM engineering team.  I seriously doubt they will compromise the Solo in any way.  ElectraM does not engineer on the fly.  Rather it may be considered a necessary modification of the production model prototype after miles of everyday road testing.   

Regarding raising the seat ........if it impacts headroom for a small % of taller people let them buy an Elio.  
Keep in mind it was ElectraM that identified the potential problem for old geezers commuting for coffee and donuts and woman wearing skirts on their daily commutes. It may be fine for young whipper snappers like you with no back, knee, or mobility issues, but perhaps it could be better for all.  It really doesn't matter what you or I think about it.......they will do what they need to do.  It looks awkward, ElectraM says it can be fixed, hell let them fix it.  If they can't do a simple fix they will no doubt leave it as is.   I don't know if it's an issue for me until I test drive it.  I won't encourage Jerry in any way so stay calm.    If it turns out to be an issue, I'll buy the SRK.......a win win for three wheelers.

Regarding the Mustang, I've driven one.  Sweet, but I didn't see it as functional enough to own one.  I needed a 4 door sedan and a pickup.  I couldn't afford a fun sporty ride like the Mustang.  However, I can get by with the Solo's single door on a commuter vehicle designed and marketed to be a functional supplement to my current 4 door.
I was not referencing the Mustangs 2-door or "sporty" characteristics. I was comparing the "humps" that seems to have been made into a problem.
And yes, there have been days that I've had extreme back pain from injury and fatigue and still had no problem getting in and out of the Mustang.
I've  simply used my arm to assist my back and hurt or weak leg over the hump and into the vehicle. Easy peesy. No pain, no fuss.
I did it that way more than I wished I had cause to. Not so much now that I've time to exercise correctly.
I'd actually done that for years till I got enough strength back into my back and legs.
I have chronic arthritis in my lower back.

Ironic... Engineering on the fly is exactly what this is.

In regards to "Regarding raising the seat ........"if it impacts headroom for a small % of taller people let them buy an Elio."

Nice. I'm 6' 2". What was all that about "Functional for the masses"?

By your reasoning,  if someone is unwilling to do the easy, simple, thing of assisting that trailing leg with their arm...
For the sake of re-engineering and delays on a perfectly good vehicle, perhaps they should consider something else instead as well.
Required listening... House of Lords - Can't find my way home
This version kicks. There's just no other way to describe it. Shivers. Turn...it...up!
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#26
Funny .... with all my griping .... getting in and out is absolutely no problem for me. I´ll not bother you with what I really consider critical!

BTW

Australian Phil is a lot better at keeping his throng informed. He posts videos and results at least once a month

http://tiltingvehicle.blogspot.de/


[Image: skid8.jpg]
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#27
It was freaking Sarcasm.  There will be no Elio to purchase and 6'-2" isn't particularly tall in terms of the Solos available headroom whether decreased slightly or not.  

This discussion reminds me of ElioOwners discussions.  You assume delays on a perfectly good vehicle and I assume the likelihood of minor changes and no delays to make the Solo better.  Again,  ElectraM has in house engineering and car building talent to make any changes that may have been determined by road testing the #001 Solo.  It was built for testing purposes.  Modifications may be required........big deal.  
My thoughts are totally irrevalant to you and/or what Electra Meccanica's determines needs to be done

(11-27-2016, 02:09 PM)paravil Wrote: Funny .... with all my griping .... getting in and out is absolutely no problem for me. I´ll not bother you with what I really consider critical!

BTW

Australian Phil is a lot better at keeping his throng informed. He posts videos and results at least once a month

http://tiltingvehicle.blogspot.de/


[Image: skid8.jpg]
Whatever our individual concerns or gripes may be, the end result will be determined by Electra Meccanica and we will decide to buy or not to buy based on individual needs.  

Unfortunately, Phil's concept is too far out from ever getting into a production vehicle in my foreseeable future.  As a four wheeled vehicle it would unlikely meet USA auto classification safety requirements.  It would be 10 years in auto compliance testing.
White Hot Solo #166
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#28
LOL. Some of us are engineers, by character, interests, style, lack of social skills, mechanical ability, etc. In everything but the degree. We like fixing things, even things that aren't ours. Even if our "help" isn't wanted or appreciated.

There is no need to alter the sill/battery box. It this the weatherstripping seam that needs to be lowered, moved, adjusted. It really shouldn't be that hard. The seat s/b fine without raising the whole seat, but the front of the seat bottom might need to be raised an inch or so. Adjustable seats cost both time and weight, but it should also be an easy fix.

One of the old Murphy's Laws corollaries is "The first 90% of the job takes 90% of the time. The last 10% takes the other 90%.". Elio burned through almost $100M before they even started doing any R&D or engineering. It was not until they started on the E1 series that they gave any thought to reality. That is why all the changes and delays.

OTOH, EMV has done a much better job or both R&D and engineering. There will always be lessons learned as they get closer to production, but at some point they need to finalize design and start production. Hopefully they will reach that point soon.
I'm done.
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#29
Rick,
I agree to disagree on this particular subject.
I still like your attitude and your point of view regardless.
For what it's worth, here's the car I've never had a problem getting in or out of.
Even when I had no intact clavicles, three broken ribs, a broken jaw and a bunged hip socket.


.jpg   mustangehump1.jpg (Size: 20.94 KB / Downloads: 44)
.jpg   mustanghump2.jpg (Size: 18.05 KB / Downloads: 43)
.jpg   mustanghump3.jpg (Size: 16.14 KB / Downloads: 43)

For perspective, the device in the first picture is a 4 7/8" long Garmin GPS.
The height difference of the crest of the hump to the floor is well over 6".
Required listening... House of Lords - Can't find my way home
This version kicks. There's just no other way to describe it. Shivers. Turn...it...up!
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#30
I don't want to step on any toes here (fearing 'banishment'/shunning akin to elioowners.com), however....
not being an engineer, I prefer to leave the engineering to the professionals (i.e. Electra Meccanica). I am willing to pay them for their professional expertise/experience. I can't/won't second-guess them at this point because I haven't done this for a living myself. I did work directly in the automobile assembly industry for 5 years. I've been through pre-pilot and pilot production phases as well as the ramp-up to full production. That equates nothing to this venture.
Perhaps, after we are owners of the SOLO Alpha Series vehicles, EM may ask us what we like as well as what we would like to see changed/modified for future EM vehicles.
In short, let's not get all bunged up over perceived issues BEFORE any of us have has a chance to experience them....leave ALL THAT to the Elio fanatics.
2015 Nissan Leaf owner/lover
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